Back in September, I wrote a blog post that included images of some of the ships that were going to be featured in Antoine Vanner's forthcoming novel (BRITANNIA'S BLUFF), which was published recently.
The book includes illustrations of the most important ships featured in the book. These are shown below.
I am particularly pleased that Antoine Vanner has included a battleship (the Memduhiye) that is based on one of my favourite Turkish ships, the Mesudiye.
The Mesudiye (Turkish: Happiness) was built as a central-battery ironclad for the Ottoman Navy in the 1870s. She was ordered – along with a sister ship – from Thames Iron Works and delivered in December 1875. (Her sister ship – the Hamidieh – was compulsorily purchased by the British Government at the time of the Russian war scare of 1878 and completed as HMS Sultan.)
By the end of the nineteenth century, she was obsolete and poorly maintained, and in 1898 the Ottoman government decided to have her reconstructed by the Gio. Ansaldo & C. shipyard in Genoa. When she returned to service in 1904, she was a coastal defence pre-dreadnought battleship.
Her characteristics when built were:
- Displacement: 8,797 tons
- Dimensions:
- Length: 101.02m (331ft 5in)
- Beam: 17.98m (59.0ft)
- Draught: 7.9m (25ft 11in)
- Propulsion: 8 x box boilers producing steam to power 1 x 7,431 ihp compound steam engine driving a single propeller
- Speed: 13.7 knots
- Complement: 700
- Armament: 12 × 10-inch RML guns; 3 × 7-inch RML guns
- Armour: Belt: 305mm (12-inches); Battery: 254mm (10-inches)
Her characteristics after being reconstructed were:
- Displacement: 8,980 tons
- Dimensions:
- Length: 101.02m (331ft 5in)
- Beam: 17.98m (59.0ft)
- Draught: 7.9m (25ft 11in)
- Propulsion: 16 x Niclausse boilers producing steam to power 2 x 5,500 ihp triple-expansion steam engines, each driving a propeller
- Speed: 17 knots
- Complement: 800
- Armament: 2 × 9.2-inch Vickers A guns (Not fitted); 12 × 5.9-inch Vickers D QF guns; 16 x 3-inch Vickers N QF guns; 10 x 57mm Hotchkiss QF guns; 2 x 47mm Hotchkiss QF guns
- Armour: Belt: 305mm (12-inches); Battery: 254mm (10-inches)
The Mesudiye.
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Lovely line drawings, I do love a pre dreadnought!
ReplyDeleteBest Iain
Caveadsum1471,
DeleteMost of Antoine Vanner’s books have had excellent line drawings in them. As to pre-dreadnoughts … well, they always seem to have a particular charm that’s difficult pin down.
All the best,
Bob
On Messudieh (Mesudiye in modern Turkish),
ReplyDelete[1] James Stewart, the manager of workers from a British consortium who were refitting various Ottoman ships in 1914 commented on her thus: "Docked about eight months ago. Engines, boilers and hull in good condition. New training gear fitted to the 12—6” guns and these with all the smaller guns are in good condition. The two 9.2” guns are still in England under repair, and in their turrets have been fitted dummy guns made of wood and canvas" (the report is in ADM 137/881 folios 257-258 (covering letter of 17 11.14), 259-270 (Stewart’s report), and 274-275 (Admiralty letters of 3.12.14 to the French and Russian Naval Attachés, forwarding Stewart’s information).
[2] Rear-Adm. Arthur Limpus, last head of the British Naval Mission to the Ottomans, wrote on 26 August 1914: "State of Turkish Fleet at finish of Balkan War... Messudieh, 9.2” guns required re-lining, were dismounted and sent to England and are still there" (in file LIM/103 at the Caird Library, Greenwich).
[3] And Rear Admiral Hermann Lorey’s "Der Krieg zur See 1914- 1918: Die Mittelmeer-Division" (1928: the German official history) observed that "On the first attempt, after arrival of the German crew-members from the homeland, to manoeuvre the Fleet, it was found that the 40-year old ship-of-line Messudieh could not be in the assemblage [in the context, could not manoeuvre with the other ships], as it did not even have a revolutions-indicator. It was left as a floating battery at the Dardanelles" (from ch.5, in the translation by Cdr H S Babbitt USN).
Meanwhile the Russian cruiser Sadko presumably substitutes in the novel for the actual German-built Russian protected cruiser Askold, which started the war further east but by 1915 was in the Mediterranean and attached to the Allied fleet off the Dardanelles. She maintained radio contact with the flagship of Russia's Black Sea Fleet. (I don't know that the Russians ever used Sadko as a warship name; it is in fact the title of -- and the name of the hero in -- a Rimsky-Korsakov opera.)
Toby E,
DeleteThanks for the very detailed and interesting comments about the Messudieh (I prefer the earlier way the name is rendered). She has been a firm favourite of mine ever since I commanded her during Eric Knowles’ MADASAHATTA CAMPAIGN.
I agree the the Sadko is probably intended to represent the Askold. Antoine Vanner always try to use names for the ships he features in his books that make some sort of sense … and in this case, both are people associated with the history of Novgorod.
All the best,
Bob
Bravo - and many thanks - pre-dreadnoughts are very much in mind here, as well.
ReplyDeleteFunny Little Wars,
DeleteCheers! I look forward to seeing your pre-dreadnoughts in action once the weather improves.
All the best,
Bob
Bob -
ReplyDeleteThose are great line drawings of those ships. One feels they would be great source material for a war games scratch builder!
My Capt. Horatio Trumpeter's ship is one of them there 'Edgar' class cruisers, and, will, in whatever guise will always have an 'E' name.
Speaking of naval matters, I lost all my pictures of my 'Arctic' convoy game (a glitch with my phone camera I haven't fully sorted out), so re-did it with sides reversed. This one was VERY eventful, with a rather drastic epilogue.
I also played out a convoy scenario with my chubby marine, an Azuria convoy intercepted by a PD battleship ('Royal Sceptre', I've called it) and an Edgar class cruiser. This is to be an incident in the Little Great War.
Still struggling to find the oomph to write up my backlog of completed battles...
Cheers,
Ion
Archduke Piccolo (Ion),
DeleteI totally agree! Once my current terrain-building project is complete, I hope to build some ships to go with my Belle Époque project … and I will be taking inspiration from your Chubby ships.
Sorry to read about your phone camera problems. I have considered backing up mine on my computer … and your problems have encouraged me to think seriously about doing so.
Hopefully you’ll find the time to write up your battle reports. I am certainly looking forward to seeing them when you do.
All the best,
Bob
Bob -
DeleteI always transfer my pics onto this machine - and that was the problem. Suddenly the phone decided to prioritise upon recharging via this connection, which I had no idea of using as the default option. Took me a while, and giving vent to divers expostulations of rage and frustration, to find out how to switch the thing over.
Having said that, I have now sorted the problem. But here's a thing. Why is it that the operations are so INFURIATINGLY 'helpful'. I HATE predictive text, mainly because it rarely does. If, on Excel, I type 3/4, say, then 3/4 is what I want, not March 4 or 3 April. AAARGH!!! They do it deliberately, I'm certain, and with malice aforethought.
Ever heard of 'Bastard Corporation'? Aye, well.
Cheers,
Ion
Archduke Piccolo (Ion),
DeleteCoincidentally, I left my laptop doing a backup last night ... and it was interrupted by a Windows 'automatic update'. Luckily, I didn't lose any files that were being backed up ... but I could easily have done so. I have no idea why the software programmers think that they know what the users 'want ', and I am sure we are not alone in hating this presumption on their part.
I am pleased to read that you managed to sort the problem out ... and I totally agree about the infuriating 'I know better than you' predictiveness of so many computer programs and apps! It is so ANNOYING!
All the best,
Bob
When I've got anything really important that I'm running on my PC I go into “Settings/Windows Update” and “Pause Updates” for a week. Actually though, this is normally not necessary as an icon normally appears on the right of my taskbar telling me that the PC needs to be restarted and, on seeing this, I go into Windows Update and set the time when the update will run (or do the update immediately whilst it's not going to interfere with anything that matters). So far this has protected me from MS's attempts at sabotage.
DeleteMike Hall,
DeleteThanks for the suggestion.
I have used that facility myself, but this latest update took place overnight when the laptop was unattended whilst doing its backup to a removable hard drive. I have learned my lesson and won't do that again without first disabling the automatic updates.
All the best,
Bob
BOB,
ReplyDeleteThe ships are very interesting - do like Pre-Dreadnoughts. KEV.
Kev Robertson (Kev),
DeleteI absolutely agree! I find that period of naval history of great interest as the technological changes that were taking place could make new ship designs obsolete overnight.
All the best,
Bob
Mesudiye's reconstruction in Genoa was pretty drastic but did they change the main belt? 12 inches sounds good but if it was still the original iron it would have been very vulnerable to the large guns of other pre dreadnoughts. Given everything else they did keeping the old armour would have been a little odd but ...
ReplyDeleteGiven your naval interests you might enjoy this video which I've just watched: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=65NWJyiMC38 (it covers a tour of HIJMS Mikasa which is the only surviving British built battleship/pre dreadnought in trhe world - excluding those currently playing a role as submarines.)
Mike Hall,
DeleteI think that she could have been uparmoured by placing additional compound armour over the existing iron armour but the additional weight might have been too much for her structure. Replacing the existing iron armour with new compound armour would have certainly improved her but the cost would probably have been prohibitive.
Thanks for the link to the YouTube video. I hope to watch it later today.
All the best,
Bob
[1] Mesudiye's rebuild at Genoa included a new conning tower with 200mm armour, and new turrets with 230mm armoured faces; but the original iron-armour belt does not appear to have been replaced. Naval Intelligence Dept’s Report 617 of October 1901—the Target Book on Russia (a copy is in ADM 231/33 at the National Archives)—contains a helpful “Table showing equivalent thicknesses of wrought iron, compound, ordinary steel and special armour”. Using this table, Mesudiye's 12-inch iron armour was roughly equivalent to 5 inches of modern Krupp Cemented armour. Perhaps the Ottomans reckoned this was sufficient, as the rearmed Mesudiye was only armed on the scale of an armoured cruiser, not a battleship. Or perhaps there was simply not enough money available to upgrade the substantial weight of armour involved.
ReplyDelete[2] German Navy radio-operator Georg Kopp, who served in the Black Sea in WW1 and whose memoir was published in English translation in 1931, wrote of her, "…a completely obsolete though apparently modernized battleship, quite useless to the fleet… Turkey had wanted to make his obsolete ship fit for action again, and had therefore sent her to England [an error for Italy!] to have her armament improved. In the English dockyards the Messudie had indeed been fitted with modern 15cm guns, but in place of the heavy guns ordered, wooden guns had been mounted! The real heavy armament… was to be delivered later! Turkey was still waiting for them… Nevertheless, we tried later, as far as was possible, to make the Messudie serve our ends, and use the ship so that at least her secondary armament might be of use against torpedo boats and submarines in the Dardanelles. She was anchored in the Chanak Narrows as a floating battery…" (Two lone ships, page 80).
[3] Wikipedia adds: "On the morning of 13 December [1914], the British sumbarine HMS B11 passed through the minefields and torpedoed Mesudiye, which quickly sank. Most of the crew survived... and many of her guns were salvaged and used to strengthen the defences of the Dardanelles. A battery of these guns, named in honour of the ship, helped to sink the French battleship Bouvet in March 1915." B11's commander, Lieutenant Norman Holbrook, won the VC for sinking Mesudiye. Before and during the war Holbrook commanded several submarines. He was promoted Lieutenant Commander in September 1917, retired in 1920, and was promoted Commander (retired) in 1928 -- see his entry on the Dreadnought Project website.
Toby E,
DeleteThanks again for your excellent input! Its interesting to note that despite spending so much money on rebuilding/reconstructing the Messudieh , she was still not suitable for front-line service although she seems to have performed well in the role of coastal defence.
Your mention of Lieutenant Commander Holbook's exploits reminded me that many years ago I designed a wargame about submarine operations in the Dardanelles. It was later published in the late Duncan Macfarlane's WARGAMES WORLD magazine. The game put each player into the role of the commander of a B-class submarine, and they had to manage things like their oxygen supplies and the tidal nature of the Dardanelles. When we played it at COW, several players managed to run aground, sailed into minefields, or were sunk by coastal batteries. I seem to remember that only one of them managed to get through the hazards and sink the Messudieh.
All the best,
Bob
On 1 January 1916 my grandfather - a regular in the RN and definitely a smoker - gave my then six years old father a book in which to mount cigarette cards. I suspect that the cards were all collected later but your reference to Commander Holbrook reminded me of the card for "War Incidents" No. 50, "B11 Dives to Conquer", complete with a very short but surprisingly accurate account of the event. Looking through these as a child I learnt a surprising amounts about military history (or maybe propaganda when it comes to WW1), as there were also card sets on battle flags, British army uniforms, Napoleon, plus plenty of other subjects including portrait photographs of a host of British officers I’d never heard of but who provided and interesting subject to investigate.
DeleteSwitching subjects, I hope that Toby E can be persuaded to update the Wikipedia article with his interesting additional information which doesn't deserve to remain buried in the National Archives. And I wonder whether the UK archives have anything on this matter?
Mike Hall,
DeleteThose cigarette cards are a wonderful source of ideas and inspiration, and I have several on my bookshelves. I do hope that you still have the one that your grandfather put together.
I hope that Toby E will do what you suggest ... or even write an article about the Messudieh for a future copy of the WARSHIP annual.
All the best,
Bob